99' Blaster won't run above idle...Stumped.

S

Synchronicity80

New Member
Nov 1, 2012
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Okay let me give the full story so everyone knows what is going on. I know there are other threads out there about this issue but they have not been successful for me. I run my own small engine business and have done everything to this thing that I can think of and nothing changes. This is for a customer of mine and I would like to get him his bike back as soon a possible but I must be missing something. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Symptoms: It came to me with no spark as the primary problem. Blaster will start almost first kick every time and will idle somewhat with what sounds like a miss, pop, or ping, sort of like something running out of time. If I give it gas it just bogs out and will not go up at all. If I let off of the throttle it will idle for a few seconds then die.
What I have tried: Bought a new stator off of Ebay (which has the adjustable timing slots), a new coil, and a carburetor kit.
I put the stator in as close to the same place I could tell as the old one and even tried the +4 option but no difference. Cleaned the petcock and the filters on it and the tank with fresh premix. I pulled the reeds and cage out and they seemed a little wet but that was before the carburetor was rebuilt and they were seating with no gaps and the rubber on the cage looked smooth. I flipped them over anyway just in case they weren't springy enough. I can't find any air leaks and I have bypassed the TORS system.

I then took the header and muffler off and made sure they were clean and flowing. I tried another new spark plug as well. I set the float height at 20MM and the main jet needle is at the third groove down. New main jet is a 230 and the new pilot jet is 32.5 which I believe is all stock. I even took out the main jet holder and cleaned it and made sure the 8 holes were clean and flowing. The compression checked out between 80-85 which seems low to me but I have a cheap guage and don't even know if it works correctly. I was told that the guy that bought this blaster was told that it was bored over but I haven't torn down the top end and measured the bore so I can't confirm that. So basically I have gone through everything that is in my mechanical ability several times and nothing ever changes.

The choke position makes no difference and neither does the mixture screw. There doesn't seem to be a standard mark in the case for the stator plate but I saw the Ricky stator instructions show the "0" mark at the bottom edge of the lip that sticks out of the case near the grommet slot for the wires. Could I just be out of time? Maybe I'm just missing some stupid little thing. IDK but it sure does have me baffled! Everything is stock on this machine except the pump has been blocked off and it is running premix around 32:1 ratio.

Any ideas? Thanks!:-/
 
It is a 99' and I just unplugged every connector I could find with a yellow and black wire including the box next to the CDI. They coil I bought for it is a cheap one from Ebay made in China and I'm wondering if it could be that it won't produce fast enough spark when I try to throttle it up. That and lower compression are the only two things left I can think of that could be the problem. It does have spark but acts like it is out of time to me from experience. I've tried idle screw at closed to 2.5 turns out. They only change is that it will die if turned all the way in as it should. Like I said in my first post Nothing seems to affect the way it runs. Not even the choke which leads me to believe it is an issue with the stator, reeds, or coil. I would think making carburetor adjustments would show some sort of change. This P.O.S. has be stumped bad! LOL.
 
I'm actually thinking that the compression is the issue now. After seeing that link stating anything lower than 100 PSI and already having the thought that the reading was too low it only makes since that if the vacuum from the cylinder can't suck in the air/fuel mixture to keep up with what the carburetor is supplying it wouldn't rev up. The owner wants the top end done for sure so we'll see how it goes. It will be a week or two before I get it done but I will post my results as soon as I have them. It is a cheap bike so if Namura makes a kit do any of you think that the cheaper alternative to Wiseco is a bad idea? I have put them in on 400EX bikes and haven't had any complaints so far. Thanks for the help.
 
you'll be fine with the namura, i've also ran a pro-x piston with decent results
keep us posted and welcome to BF !!!
 
:-/ Okay so I finally got the new top end kit in and installed it. Was previously bored over .040 to 67mm so I ordered a Wiseco 67 M series kit. I honed the cylinder quite a bit to remove some minor scratches but the measurements didn't really change so I am pretty sure I didn't remove very much material from the cylinder. I got it all together and my compression guage says about the same thing as it did before disassembly around 80-85 PSI. I kind of think this cheap guage is wrong because it has never really even gotten close to 100 on anything I have tried to use it on except for a 300 bayou that I did and it got up to 125+/- but I think it was actually higher to get the guage to go that high. I even put my air hose on it with the regulator set at 110 and it wouldn't even come up to 100. This all makes me think my guage is bad.

However my main concern is that when The piston goes up to compress or even down to vacuum I can hear a hissing sound like it is not holding the compression. I usually work more on 4 stroke so I'm not as familiar with the 2 stroke kits but shouldn't most circumstances be similar as far as compression and holding it like a leak down? It feels to have more compression but to me the piston seemed a bit loose in the cylinder before I put the rings on it. The feeler guage was within specs for piston clearance and so was the ring end gap.

Should it not be hissing like that? I can't tell for sure but my suspicion is that it is passing back down past the rings. All I know is I hear it coming from the intake port where the reed cage goes. Do the reeds put the back pressure on it enough to stop this? As I said, compared to normal 4 stroke scenarios this doesn't seem normal to me. Can anyone help me out on this? I really don't want to have to take it back apart and try to get another size kit and make the owner wait even longer. Thanks in advance for any replies!
 
I went ahead and continued on with the reassembly and it runs exactly the same as it did before so I haven't the slightest clue what else it could be. The only thing left that I didn't replace would be the reeds but they seem to be good. Any body have any other ideas?
 
If you run your own small engine business, get a working compression tester. Thats your first move. You need to know for sure what compression the cylinder has. If you just rebuilt the thing and its only 80 PSI, thats a problem. You won't know for sure if its your gauge until you get a new one. Don't do anything until you verify proper compression.

- Eliminate the inline fuel filter. The blaster doesnt need one, and maybe its clogged or too restrictive, not letting it get enough gas.

- Make sure the old oil pump hoses are plugged up with a screw or something

- The air screw needs to be 1 1/2 turn out as a starting point.

- Do a leakdown test.

- Pops, pings, and stuff sounds normal to me on a 2 stroke during idle. Is is a stock exhaust?
 
well you to need figure out if that comp tester is good or not. if it was bored for a 67mm piston you would normaly have the cylinder bored to the next piston size up. or at least measured to with the proper tools to make sure it is still in specs for a ring job or just piston swap. it's not going to run right if it actually has 85psi.
 
Synchronicity80 said:
I went ahead and continued on with the reassembly and it runs exactly the same as it did before so I haven't the slightest clue what else it could be. The only thing left that I didn't replace would be the reeds but they seem to be good. Any body have any other ideas?
Click to expand...

I will give you my thoughts, solutions.

First if that adjustable stator is from ricky stator they are junk, so many issues with them, I choose another option, from canada and that adjustable stator was crap also. I run a stock on with no issues. I suggest to check the stator, coil and plug cap- go here VVVVVVVVV
http://www.blasterforum.com/engine-13/ignition-troubleshooting-88-02-a-46159/ I will say that I had a coil and stator test good, but was bad only way i found that out was swapping in a known good stock one.

Make sure you have the woodruff key in when you put the flywheel back on.
I would then completely dissasemble the carb clean it good and finish the job with compressed air!

How to jet properly-
http://www.blasterforum.com/carburetor-138/adjusting-your-airscrew-pilot-jet-51060/

I too recently had issues with a harbor frieght tester but found that my viton oring had a split in it that wasn't noticeable until compressed replaced that and works perfectly! Or any autoparts store will let you borrow one free at least around here they do. You do have the piston in correctly right-windows to the intake side?

The tors box on your model has Y/B, B/W and B , the connector it's white if i remember correctly.
 
Okay. To answer some of your replies...Colby-Not to sound rude but sometimes you have to go with what you can afford and it is a brand new guage but is a cheap one. You aren't telling me anything I don't already know. I have been working on small engines for about 20 years and even have 2 years of vocational classes for it under my belt but I am still starting on my own as a full time business and still building it. I am at the same time not as experienced with the larger 2 stroke engines but mainly chainsaws etc. I am simply trying to find help here because it should be a place with more Blaster familiar people than me. I know that the compression being that low will make it run wrong. I simply need to figure out why it would still be that low with a fresh top end and if maybe I missed something or did something wrong. IDK. Now with that aside I'll try to answer everyone's questions and suggestions.

Colby--> It has a stock exhaust and I have checked it for any blockages, I have already set the air screw at 1-1/5 turns and and from 1/4-2 turns with no real difference except for closed which is normal, The carb has a fresh rebuild kit in it with the float height set, the oil pump was previously blocked off already and the lines are closed, The fuel filter makes no difference as it runs exactly the same as it did before I put it on and it is brand new.

scottj77--> I will try to get a better guage as soon as possible but I'm trying to find an error in the mean time. The only tools that I have to measure it are a caliper/micrometer and I measured the top and the bottom of the cylinder, Even after it was honed it was within what seems to be tolerable specs in my opinion. I don't currently have a way to measure down deeper in the bore. I didn't think it was necessary to go up and spend the money to have it bored. I don't have the shop capabilities to do it myself.

slickerthanyou--> The stator plate is just a cheap one I got for $65 from Ebay from Caltric which I suspect is made in China. Also put on a new coil that is the same quality. I wish it wasn't this way but you all gotta understand I'm just trying to keep the costs as minimal as possible as asked by some people. Some just don't want to spend much on a cheap old quad and I completely understand that. The flywheel key is in there and is completely fine. All jetting is stock and new from the new kit. Yes the piston is facing the right direction with the ports facing the reeds. As far as the auto parts stores around here I don't think they have guages for borrowing but they do sell them for automotive. I am thinking about buying one there and using the adapters from the cheap one to use for these quads but I don't have the extra funds right now.

So what I am suspecting is that the cylinder is out of round in the middle of the bore where I cannot measure because I put the head on the jug and turned it upside down and with the rings on the piston as they would be if connected to the rod put it in the cylinder and as you push it down it will hiss and go down and sounds like it is leaking past the ring end about where the bottom ring gap is. After I put it all together the first time and ran it for a few minutes and then took it back apart I noticed it had a scratch about 1/8 inch wide going up and down the full length of piston travel. It was very shallow like just a place where it was fitting tighter than the rest. It was on the exhaust side about the same place as the stud would be on the front left if sitting on the bike.

I used a feeler guage to check the clearance that Wiseco supplies which is .002/.51mm and without the rings on and the piston going all the way to one side it is way out of spec but with the rings on which allows the piston to center in the cylinder they feeler guage feels perfect all the way around the entire circumference of it. So the scratch seems to tell me that the piston is not tight enough in the bore in the middle and the air leaking around the ring gap is from the cylinder having a wider spot in it. The gap falls right in between the intake ports right above the left piston skirt port facing forward. The piston and rings that came out of it were in good shape but are doing the same thing in all the same spots but actually leak just a bit less because the rings are thicker so to me it seems like it would for sure be the bore.

The problem is that we just spent over $110 for this Wiseco kit and now it looks like we're gonna have to spend even more for another jug. If I had this one bored then it would cost even more to have it bored then would have to buy another piston and rings of at least $85. On the other hand a new jug will cost just as much maybe more. I know there is supposed to be a break in period and that the compression should go up as the rings seat but Shouldn't it have at least closer to 100 psi minimum before they seat? IDk, I'm so sick and tired of even looking at this piece of crap but need to get it fixed. Which way should I go in your opinions? Please keep any smart ass comments to yourselves and try to look at the whole picture and from a personal outlook. Thanks for the replies either way.

P.S. I'm going to try to attach photos for reference.
 
The hissing sound is your compression! Normal! When you try to kick it is it very easy like can you kick it with your hand with little resistance? Or is there good resistance?

I understand about getting it done as cheap as possible we all do, however sometimes learning how to rebuild a motor that your not familar with mistakes are made. No implying nothing, however we have all made errors and sometimes still do.

To do the job your trying to do, and not having the proper tools or working ones is just shooting yourself in the foot. Try a new oring on your tester (found at any local hardware store) and see if that works, If you have a Napa, autozone, advance auto, o'reilys, auto parts store near you they have compression testers that have the adapters to fit most all plug holes, and it is free to borrow. You can also get the measuring tools for the cylinder at most of those places too.

You said that you cannot check the bore correctly, but bought a piston kit for it Honed it and it the bore measurement seemed ok-that isn't gonna work!
You can take the jug to any local machine shop most will measure it for ya for nothing, and if it needs bored then let them do that, nothing wrong with that! it'll cost 35-60 bucks to have it bored, Once bored the ports need chamfered or the rings wont last long at all possibly the first kick if a ring gets caught.

Another jug will be well over $100 a new one will be big bucks!

You did notice that the piston ring area has pins in it and the rings are spaced according to the pins. once in the bore they should move unless the pins are gone.
 
Synchronicity80 said:
slickerthanyou--> The stator plate is just a cheap one I got for $65 from Ebay from Caltric which I suspect is made in China. Also put on a new coil that is the same quality. I wish it wasn't this way but you all gotta understand I'm just trying to keep the costs as minimal as possible as asked by some people. Some just don't want to spend much on a cheap old quad and I completely understand that. The flywheel key is in there and is completely fine. All jetting is stock and new from the new kit. Yes the piston is facing the right direction with the ports facing the reeds. As far as the auto parts stores around here I don't think they have guages for borrowing but they do sell them for automotive. I am thinking about buying one there and using the adapters from the cheap one to use for these quads but I don't have the extra funds right now.

So what I am suspecting is that the cylinder is out of round in the middle of the bore where I cannot measure because I put the head on the jug and turned it upside down and with the rings on the piston as they would be if connected to the rod put it in the cylinder and as you push it down it will hiss and go down and sounds like it is leaking past the ring end about where the bottom ring gap is. After I put it all together the first time and ran it for a few minutes and then took it back apart I noticed it had a scratch about 1/8 inch wide going up and down the full length of piston travel. It was very shallow like just a place where it was fitting tighter than the rest. It was on the exhaust side about the same place as the stud would be on the front left if sitting on the bike.

I used a feeler guage to check the clearance that Wiseco supplies which is .002/.51mm and without the rings on and the piston going all the way to one side it is way out of spec but with the rings on which allows the piston to center in the cylinder they feeler guage feels perfect all the way around the entire circumference of it. So the scratch seems to tell me that the piston is not tight enough in the bore in the middle and the air leaking around the ring gap is from the cylinder having a wider spot in it. The gap falls right in between the intake ports right above the left piston skirt port facing forward. The piston and rings that came out of it were in good shape but are doing the same thing in all the same spots but actually leak just a bit less because the rings are thicker so to me it seems like it would for sure be the bore.

The problem is that we just spent over $110 for this Wiseco kit and now it looks like we're gonna have to spend even more for another jug. If I had this one bored then it would cost even more to have it bored then would have to buy another piston and rings of at least $85. On the other hand a new jug will cost just as much maybe more. I know there is supposed to be a break in period and that the compression should go up as the rings seat but Shouldn't it have at least closer to 100 psi minimum before they seat? IDk, I'm so sick and tired of even looking at this piece of crap but need to get it fixed. Which way should I go in your opinions? Please keep any smart ass comments to yourselves and try to look at the whole picture and from a personal outlook. Thanks for the replies either way.
Click to expand...

Caltric is the stator i got from a canadian ebay dealer, their warranty is sh*t too as they still have never honored it, keep getting excuses that its coming from overseas and stuck in customs, it's been over 6 months and they stop responding to me! I've learned that cheaper is always best!

On a fresh top end or ring job your looking for minimum of 120psi!

Oh and i blew up two complete rebuilds $1000 each before i learned!
 
slickerthanyou said:
The hissing sound is your compression! Normal! When you try to kick it is it very easy like can you kick it with your hand with little resistance? Or is there good resistance?

You did notice that the piston ring area has pins in it and the rings are spaced according to the pins. once in the bore they should move unless the pins are gone.
Click to expand...

Yes I can move it with my hand but does take a bit of force. Not like one fingered or anything. It does feel like good resistance but with 80-90 psi it would be somewhat verses something really low. Also yes the rings were centered on the locating pins in the grooves and the numbers facing up on the rings. The Wiseco Kit says that the rings are not groove specific but the old piston is so I know the rings aren't in the wrong places either. I know I could get it bored but like I said before then I have just wasted the money on this 67mm kit and will have to at least buy the 67.25mm .050 over piston kit which runs around $85 but I guess I have no other choice.:(
 
If the kicker goes down easy with your hand then it's gonna need to have the cylinder checked properly as your assumption about the bore is more than likely correct. Before i'd do all that i would get a good compression tester and redo the test. Otherwise your just guessing and spending money for nothing , just like the song from dire straits!
 
slickerthanyou said:
I'm a bit confused as you bought a 67mm piston and try to squeeze it in a 66.79, 66.95, and 66.54 hole?
Click to expand...

Yes because these calipers are not 100% accurate being digital. They are affected by relative humidity for one and it is humanly impossible to know if you are measuring exactly across the diameter if the hole with the tangs of the micrometer. The stock size is 66mm and when I measure the bore it is as close to 67mm on an average of the measurements. If I went with the smaller one then the piston slap and clearance would be even more and if I went with the 67.25mm the piston may have tightly fit but the rings would have been extremely compressed if they would have fit at all. Not trying to sound defensive but trying to explain the reasoning for the decision if it makes sense.
 
slickerthanyou said:
If the kicker goes down easy with your hand then it's gonna need to have the cylinder checked properly as your assumption about the bore is more than likely correct. Before i'd do all that i would get a good compression tester and redo the test. Otherwise your just guessing and spending money for nothing , just like the song from dire straits!
Click to expand...

Assuming the tester is wrong and pretending it had even the minimum compression to meet specs...Any ideas what could cause the root of the initial problem? The whole start of this post is because it just bogs and won't rev up at all above idle. I have checked everything I can think of from the tors to the carb to the compression. What I mean is if everyone says my tester is bad or inaccurate then unless it told me more than what it really has then I would think it wouldn't start at all. Secondly if the tester was bad and it had more compression than what it is telling me then I would think that there is another underlying problem I am overlooking. Am I making sense with that? LOL.
 
Synchronicity80 said:
Assuming the tester is wrong and pretending it had even the minimum compression to meet specs...Any ideas what could cause the root of the initial problem? The whole start of this post is because it just bogs and won't rev up at all above idle. I have checked everything I can think of from the tors to the carb to the compression. What I mean is if everyone says my tester is bad or inaccurate then unless it told me more than what it really has then I would think it wouldn't start at all. Secondly if the tester was bad and it had more compression than what it is telling me then I would think that there is another underlying problem I am overlooking. Am I making sense with that? LOL.
Click to expand...

Yes complete sense! Most times compression under 100 won't even start! With that said I'd do a leak test on it since you had the top end off, It may not hold compression because the base gasket area leak, reedcage area leak, head gasket leak, maybe the hissing isn't the normal sound?

Any chance of a video?
 
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